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  • #12996
    doktor.oswaldo
    doktor.oswaldo
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    One question to the suggested Layout: Why is the order of the brackets like that: { [ ] } and not like thath { } [ ].

    It is not a big problem but seems rather special.

    Below a crop from a PC QWERTZ keyboards, so it is to get close to that.

    Interesting, in the US, Swiss and German Layout ( and ) are right next to each other (Of course not on the same keys, that would made it to easy to switch).
    The reason I ask is, because I believe a lot of people insert both braces after each other and then use the back key to get inside it (You see that a lot in programming at least). This is not a productive thing to do so it isn’t to bad to make it harder ;-).

    #13064
    Jacob_S
    Jacob_S
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    As the layout seems to be mainly for German users and only additionally for Scandic/Swiss etc. I would favor choosing German Strg/Entf etc., especially as some others already said they don’t really mind what’s printed there.
    But I have to admit that’s easy to say as a German ;)
    As you can see above I personally prefer Strg over STRG/strg but that’s one of the less important things.

    Regarding the positioning of symbols I like raphaelcno’s version a lot, but would suggest swapping ‘ to the ä key and # to the ü key, as I need ‘ way more often. Or are there arguments for the current placement?

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    #13069
    EskeRahn
    EskeRahn
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    As the layout seems to be mainly for German users and only additionally for Scandic/Swiss etc. I would favor choosing German Strg/Entf etc., especially as some others already said they don’t really mind what’s printed there.
    But I have to admit that’s easy to say as a German ;)

    The whole point in this thread is that people tell what would be the best qwertZ keyboard for them, so we should listen to you. That people of other nationalities (like me) might find it closer to what they want than the US qwertY, I would say is just a bonus.

    Have we heard any voices from Austria in here? Do they use the exact same layout as in Germany, or does it (like Swiss) have some differences?

    This claims that it is the same for Germany and Austria AND displays the differences with the one for Switzerland&Luxembourg according to IBM. The difference mainly being the later ease the use of French. Plus Brackets, Braces and other symbols placed differently

    I early on suggested an ‘open’ layout, intended to be used not as a general international keyboard, but as a base for national layouts usable in many countries, with prints of the national letters ‘missing’ on a few keys, so we would have to remember these few by hart (or write on the keys manually)

    #13075
    Keyahnig
    Keyahnig
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    As far as I know Austrians use the same layout as Germans.

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    #13110
    doktor.oswaldo
    doktor.oswaldo
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    As the layout seems to be mainly for German users and only additionally for Scandic/Swiss etc. I would favor choosing German Strg/Entf etc., especially as some others already said they don’t really mind what’s printed there.

    But I have to admit that’s easy to say as a German ;)

    The whole point in this thread is that people tell what would be the best qwertZ keyboard for them, so we should listen to you. That people of other nationalities (like me) might find it closer to what they want than the US qwertY, I would say is just a bonus.

    Have we heard any voices from Austria in here? Do they use the exact same layout as in Germany, or does it (like Swiss) have some differences?

    This claims that it is the same for Germany and Austria AND displays the differences with the one for Switzerland&Luxembourg according to IBM. The difference mainly being the later ease the use of French. Plus Brackets, Braces and other symbols placed differently

    I early on suggested an ‘open’ layout, intended to be used not as a general international keyboard, but as a base for national layouts usable in many countries, with prints of the national letters ‘missing’ on a few keys, so we would have to remember these few by hart (or write on the keys manually)

    As a Swiss I have to admit. We are a really small market. And Switzerland is the iPhone country per excellence. So while I would love to have a real swiss layout to choose from it is probably not worth the struggle out of a business perspective. I think it is better to make a Layout which fits one market perfectly then try to blend all possible qwertz layouts together. Yes some people might be of the loosing side. But the worst thing for the phone would be when everybody says: “Yes the keyboard is good, but has a strange layout”. It is way more acceptable if someone says “Yes it is good, it has the US-Layout tough”. This has never stopped early-adopters.

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    #13124
    EskeRahn
    EskeRahn
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    …It is way more acceptable if someone says “Yes it is good, it has the US-Layout tough”. This has never stopped early-adopters.

    Feel exactly the same, especially if it is the print only, and we can select a national layout if we so choose. So we can choose between using the standard layout printed, but not perfectly fitting, or a national layout slightly different from the printed.

    I would say that more than 90% of the time I use my Danish-printed PC-keyboard with a logic US-layout, primarily to get to brackets and braces easily for coding.(but also since there were no Danish layout for the first computers I used, I made my own keyboard driver back then…)

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    #13220
    Zimeon
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    Pretty much the opposite for me, 99% of the time I use Scandinavian layout and only when there’s some compability issues i revert to US layout. Anyway, hope to get some official answer what the options will be, if there will be any.

    #13222
    EskeRahn
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    Pretty much the opposite for me, 99% of the time I use Scandinavian layout and only when there’s some compability issues i revert to US layout. Anyway, hope to get some official answer what the options will be, if there will be any.

    Don’t get me wrong, my point was that it is not that important, what is actually printed on the key, as long as it is not way off. I mean a Dvorak print or the shifted QWERTY print would be problematic used with Danish layout. But anything roughly close would work with Danish for me. And the suggested QWERTZ is certainly close enough for me :) – But sure I would prefer a Scandinavian print.

    #13255
    dreamflasher
    dreamflasher
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    The absolutely best would have been to find a way for people to print their own layout :D I have no clue how this production processes work, but if one would get the US layout per default, and you can pay another 10usd for your customized layout, gosh!

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    #13261
    EskeRahn
    EskeRahn
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    The absolutely best would have been to find a way for people to print their own layout :D I have no clue how this production processes work, but if one would get the US layout per default, and you can pay another 10usd for your customized layout, gosh!

    Now THAT would be awresome, though I doubt $10 could cover the cost of handling them individually…
    Continuing on the customization wishes, imagine 3D-prints in a suitable partly transparent elastic material…

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