Root-related questions

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  • #16743
    jason
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    Well putting an official image on for a different OS is different from a custom one. But I didn’t ask the original question but it was getting lost in the other thread and it’s worth getting an answer on.

    #16801
    Craig
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    There definately are sometimes apps that don’t work on rooted phone. Pokemon Go was one I ran into couple years ago…early versions worked fine, then there was some versions with easy workarounds (rename su binary) then stopped working and by then I didn’t care about it enough, but I think there were further workarounds for a while.

    I also believe things like tap-to-pay may not work on rooted phones, something about safetynet.

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    #16864
    kontakt
    Benjamin
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    There definately are sometimes apps that don’t work on rooted phone. Pokemon Go was one I ran into couple years ago…early versions worked fine, then there was some versions with easy workarounds (rename su binary) then stopped working and by then I didn’t care about it enough, but I think there were further workarounds for a while.

    I also believe things like tap-to-pay may not work on rooted phones, something about safetynet.

    They are working fine using magisk as root-solution.

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    #17005
    jason
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    Well Pokemon Go was a legit reason people were cheating :D

    #17013
    Noir
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    People are still, and depending the OS and Security Patch root isn’t even necessary. For that specific app there has always been a workarond until today. Banking/TAN apps however are most of the time unusuable on rooted or even non-stock unrooted roms. If someone really depends on those apps, i would not recommend rooting.

    In my opinion, rooting is not as necessary as it was years ago. An unlocked bootloader to flash a custom recovery is enough to get rid of bloatware and unwanted system-apps, manually backing up and restoring app-data, and tampering with the hosts file for example.

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    #17016
    EskeRahn
    EskeRahn
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    In my opinion, rooting is not as necessary as it was years ago. An unlocked bootloader to flash a custom recovery is enough to get rid of bloatware and unwanted system-apps, manually backing up and restoring app-data, and tampering with the hosts file for example.

    People really should try ADB, we can disable (almost) anything without the need for neither root nor flash, just a pc and a usb-cable…
    See https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/root-related-questions-split-from-support-time-thread/page/1/#post-16686 with link

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    #34699
    patrykgrzesiak
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    I intend to root my Pro1 as soon as I get it.
    I have a question about support of updates on rooted device – I mean rooted stock ROM, not a custom one. On Moto Z, for example, it is rather tricky and involves unrooting, flashing old stock ROM, updating to new one and then rooting again. Userdata is deleted in the process. I would very much like to be able to update rooted stock Pro1 without loosing userdata

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    #35287
    Noob
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    Thanks for the link @eskerahn. It’s good to know what you can do with ADB but personally I prefer to have root access, just like I prefer to have root/admin access on a computer in case I need it. For me my phone is basically a portable computer (especially with a full keyboard); , and I want to be able to access it as such. Potentially powerful tools like a terminal/console or DB editor feel pretty crippled without root since you can’t access most of the file system. Also, some apps really need root access, like Wireguard, AFWall, TitaniumBackup.

    Besides, what about when you want to do something on the spot and don’t have access to a computer? :)

    I might give LineageOS a go, but after using it for so long on the Droid 4 I have some concerns about its stability. Maybe it’s specific to this phone’s port (and the fact that I used running nightly builds) but I’ve got all kinds of weird issues in the last build and it would be good to be on a stable official OS. I just don’t want Google Services on it. I tried unGoogling my Moto Z (which I bought in anticipation of the keyboard mod, ha) but wasn’t successful and gave up, not sure if I’ll try the same with this one.

    #35301
    EskeRahn
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    Thanks for the link @eskerahn. It’s good to know what you can do with ADB but personally I prefer to have root access, just like I prefer to have root/admin access on a computer in case I need it. For me my phone is basically a portable computer (especially with a full keyboard); , and I want to be able to access it as such. Potentially powerful tools like a terminal/console or DB editor feel pretty crippled without root since you can’t access most of the file system. Also, some apps really need root access, like Wireguard, AFWall, TitaniumBackup.

    Besides, what about when you want to do something on the spot and don’t have access to a computer? :)

    I might give LineageOS a go, but after using it for so long on the Droid 4 I have some concerns about its stability. Maybe it’s specific to this phone’s port (and the fact that I used running nightly builds) but I’ve got all kinds of weird issues in the last build and it would be good to be on a stable official OS. I just don’t want Google Services on it. I tried unGoogling my Moto Z (which I bought in anticipation of the keyboard mod, ha) but wasn’t successful and gave up, not sure if I’ll try the same with this one.

    Consider rooting a bit like walking a dog without a leash. Usually a much more pleasant experience (for both dog and owner) BUT the risk of things accidentally happening is also bigger. From the dog being hit by a car to the dog biting another dog (or human). I’m not saying you should not root (I usually walk my dog without a leash too…), only that people should always remember there is risks involved.

    #35329
    VaZso
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    Consider rooting a bit like walking a dog without a leash. Usually a much more pleasant experience (for both dog and owner) BUT the risk of things accidentally happening is also bigger. From the dog being hit by a car to the dog biting another dog (or human). I’m not saying you should not root (I usually walk my dog without a leash too…), only that people should always remember there is risks involved.

    I am running Linux on my own computer and naturally, I am also own the root user.
    Personally, I don’t want to give root access to anything which doesn’t need root access, but I need root access to gain control over my phone – running Linux environment and related stuff.

    Under Windows, where initially all programs had full access to everywhere and bad behaviour became the main usage condition, the manufacturer tried to build additional control layers above the bad usage habit. Also under company environment, the whole user can be controlled “globally”, but in that case the computer is not owned by the user who uses it.

    Under Linux, nobody ever really wanted to run user applications under root, that account was always used for special purposes (in Windows, the NT line had similar capabilities which all modern Windows systems are based on, but also user applications had to be grown up).
    Instead, all applications are running at user level, also some system components has its own users and lowered privileges.
    However, sometimes we need root privileges and if I am not have system level access to my hardware, then the hardware is not really mine.

    Then Android is a system which builds on an idea that the owner of the operating system is Google and the user is only a user. That way user is not able to break anything in the system, thus, unneeded warranty issues may be lower… but that way the user is not the real owner and the physical owner’s possibilities are restricted.

    I understand that most of the users really don’t need full access to the hardware, but…
    I don’t like when the system I use wants to protect me from myself especially if that also means my hands are hold down.

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    #35344
    EskeRahn
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    I don’t like when the system I use wants to protect me from myself especially if that also means my hands are hold down.

    It is better that people that know what they are doing can lift the protection, than people not knowing what they are doing have to figure out how to apply protection….. IMHO

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    #35348
    VaZso
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    It is better that people that know what they are doing can lift the protection, than people not knowing what they are doing have to figure out how to apply protection….. IMHO

    Yes, exactly.

    Also, the same applies to restrictive bank applications.
    I understand the idea behind it, but independently of rooting – there are also risks in normal user applications which may have malicious codes included.
    ..but they chase rooted phones and prevent running on them.
    Isn’t it a false sense of security?

    #35352
    EskeRahn
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    ..but they chase rooted phones and prevent running on them.
    Isn’t it a false sense of security?

    I guess that on rooted phones the risk of an app stealing entries to other programs -including credentials entered for bank apps- are higher, and it is to prevent that scenario, they reject running on a rooted device.
    But of course that it is NOT roored does not remove all risks, but some risks are reduced.

    So secure? Nah. But less insecure? Sure.

    #35357
    VaZso
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    I guess that on rooted phones the risk of an app stealing entries to other programs -including credentials entered for bank apps- are higher, and it is to prevent that scenario, they reject running on a rooted device.

    That way the same issue may happen on every PC.
    Why phones are that special (rhetorical question)?

    #35363
    EskeRahn
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    That way the same issue may happen on every PC.
    Why phones are that special (rhetorical question)?

    …And that is exactly why it is (also) a bad idea to have ordinary users work with an account with administrative rights in daily use. And also why ‘newer’ versions of windows give you a security prompt asking you to confirm that you really want to use this extra power at some situations. Like installing an app available for all users, and not just current user.

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